Episode 396: Coaching At Cocodona 250 Mile

This year I went to the Cocodona 250 to follow a few of my coaching clients along the 250 mile, 125 mile courses. As the sport of ultramarathon continues to grow, these type of experiences are beneficial as both a coach and an athlete. This episode highlights what I learned about some differences these longer ultras present.

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Episode Transcript:

Alright, everyone. Welcome back to another episode of the human performance outliers podcast. I'm your host, Zach bidder today. I've got a topic episode for you and it's kind of a bit of a reflection actually. So recently I was able to go out to the Coca Dona two 50, which the Coca Dona events are actually more than one event.

There's the kind of big one, the 250 miler that begins just north of Phoenix. And then they travel up. through Sedona and eventually into Flagstaff to cover  250 miles of desert trail. I should say desert and kind of high pine trail and  It's a doozy, as you can imagine, 250 miles, there's no easy way to go 250 miles, but inside of that event Aravaipa, the organization that puts it on has also included an event called the Sedona 125, which this year was the second year of that event.

And then the  Eldon 38, which was the inaugural event for this year. So.  One of the reasons I went out to the event this year was because on my coaching side of things, I actually had six athletes participating in those three events. I had two doing the 2 53 doing the 1 25 and one doing the 38. So as a coach, I want to try to get out to some of the events this year when I have multiple clients there, or if the event offers something that would be what I would consider a really good educational opportunity for me as an ultra endurance runner and as a coach.

And now that these 200 milers are getting more and more popular, it just made a lot of sense for me to go out for this one because there's just Multiple reasons for me to check it out, just to see the whole event, to help out with some crewing and pacing with my coaching clients that were there and to kind of just see some of the stuff we were strategizing and training and how they actually played out and hopefully learn and refine some of the stuff.

So this episode is more or less, this is going to be kind of reflecting on some of the things that I think we're interesting or unique about this event. And then. I'll compare to some degree, maybe what they would be like compared to typical ultra marathons, if you want to even say that. I mean, there's just so many ultra marathons now it's hard to even say like, Oh, this is the average ultra marathon.

I mean, there's some characteristics that tend to be more consistent and things that are a little unique sometimes that are very much worth considering if you find yourself doing an event that kind of includes those. So let's get into it. One of the things I think that makes the Coca Dona events really unique is  both the 250 and the 125, they have just a very, very difficult start.

There's no way to really arrive at the first major checkpoint without probably feeling like you've maybe overextended yourself a little bit or that you're craving that aid station a little bit more than you would like to in your mind's eye, given where you are on the course and how much running you have left.

So for example,  for the two 50, you start out, they start at 5 a. m. So you quickly end up heading into some kind of hot weather, hot desert weather. And it's basically a climb up to This, this spot called Crown King, and it's roughly 38 miles into the race. And there's just not a lot of great spots between the start  And that first major aid station to really provide any support for the runners.

So  right out the gate, you have like a mandatory gear list of different things you have to have with you. And that does change from one degree to the next in some cases, because.  As you can imagine, if you're running a 250 mile race, there's parts where you're kind of up a little higher when you're closer to Flagstaff at night and it gets cold and you definitely want to be prepared for cold weather.

And then there's going to be the heat of the day in the desert where you're going to need a lot more fluids than normal. And you need to be prepared for that hot desert sun. And when you have large gaps between support. That just means during stretches like that, the mandatory gear list is going to be a little heavier on how much fluid you have to carry.

So for Cocodona specifically, they had a minimum carrying amount of four liters of fluid. So that's a lot of, a lot of water weight. And right out the gate, that basically tells me one thing as a coach,  and it's, it's, you know,  If you're going to have to be carrying that level of gear that level of extra weight, it does definitely behoove a runner someone, a participant to be getting accustomed to that scenario where they're not just out there moving at gold race pace, but moving with the type of set setup that they're going to have to deal with for portions of this event.

So,  you know, you start getting these heavy packs and stuff like that.  That probably means you're going to end up hiking more than you would normally if you didn't have to have that pack just to get that extra weight. You're going to want to get used to knowing what it feels like to have that much extra weight on you.

You're also going to want to have to know things like how my pack is and  how it sits on me with the different types of clothing I'm wearing and things like that. How does that change from one section of the course to the next in terms of how that pack maybe chases you? So like Maybe you run in your pack in normal conditions and there's one spot that bothers you, but everything else seems fine.

So you take care of that one spot. But then perhaps when you add four liters of water, you get the desert sun.  The rest of your gears may be a little bit different. A lot of times in the dry heat, you want to keep covered with light colored clothing and things like that. So maybe, maybe that pack rubs a little differently in that scenario and you want to be prepared for how that's going to be versus how maybe it will be when you don't have to carry quite as much fluid with you near the end stages of the race.

When you're up high closer to Flagstaff and going through the night when the weather is a little more chilly on the chilly end of things. So that's just kind of like one example.  What I think makes Cocodona unique is just the sheer distance of it and the fact that it kind of starts in the desert and then you end up into the pines and flagstaff.

You're crossing like just a variety of different kinds of climates and then you add just the weather fluctuations and desert climates from the heat of the day to the cool of the night in general. And even if you'd stay in the same spot, you're going to have a fair bit of variance there. So going into the event, I just knew like with my clients that are certainly the ones doing the 250, but in general, we're gonna have to be ready for that sort of a variance in kind of what proper, what, what different preparations you will need for different phases of the race.

So if I fast forward a little bit and head into the Sedona 125, you're sort of in a similar setting.  You have a really long stretch  that goes through a very hot section of the course. So The 125ers they started in a spot called Jerome, which is a little higher So it wasn't quite as warm, but you hit an exposed hot area going into Sedona During the heat of the day and you don't see your crew until that first aid station there Which again is roughly like I think was 37 miles in if I remember correctly the first major aid station in Sedona and It It's just one of those things where  just like with the 250, you're going to probably come into that aid station thinking to yourself, this could get really tough, or this is maybe a little tougher than I thought it would be.

Or  I feel like I've been working a little harder than what 37 miles would give me in the context of pacing myself for 125.  So I think the kind of general theme I took away from those two pieces of Portions of this event was when you get these long events, these 250 milers and 125 milers. They are just kind of an extrapolation of what I think with a hundred miles, which is  If you think you're going slow enough You're probably still going too fast  and I would lean on just basically kind of the overall data we have with ultra runners and how they're kind of pace depreciates over the course of an event to kind of justify that most people probably are going out a little too fast in general as a community of runners.

We're probably all going out just a little too fast in general in most cases in order to really optimize.  So when you have scenarios where the event is drawn out even further, and you have these components where you have an environment that is going to just be that much more harsh, and you're potentially going to be giving back more for every, you know, Match, so to speak that you burn in that area of the course, it just becomes  a little bit more consequential if you make a mistake in that phase of the, of that course.

So one of the interesting things that I noticed was, I was at the Sedona aid station, the longest, I think, and saw the most runners in that one. And one thing that I saw through there was just, you know, most runners were coming into there looking a little bit like they'd seen a ghost and not quite as fresh as maybe I would have thought.

Imagine someone would want to look at that phase. It wasn't necessarily bad. I mean, there were definitely people who had really good races at the end of the day. So it's just kind of partly a reality of just kind of like the ebb and flow of what you're going to have in an ultra marathon to some degree. 

The interesting thing that I saw amongst that group of people was runners that came through that age. Station and sort of took the opportunity to kind of refocus and reset  tended to do better or go out into the next phase of the course with a little bit of less of a just frantic nature and kind of like regain control and regain perspective versus like coming into that aid station thinking like, okay, I got to hurry up and get out of here.

I got to do this. I got to do that and then got out and then kind of rushed themselves a little bit.  What I find when people do that is  You sort of have this situation where  in order to really kind of wrap your head around what you're trying to do in an event like this, you kind of need to have these breakpoints in the event where you have a chance to kind of almost just like,  Shut things down momentarily and then start back up to the degree where in your mind you're thinking All right  finished that stage that's done.

That's complete check it off the list Now it's time to kind of refocus and focus on the next section versus feeling like there's this Continuation between that stage and the next stage that doesn't have any cognitive breaks from it so You know My one big takeaway is when you get these main aid stations where you have good crew support, we have great aid station support when you're planning ahead of time,  all while you're planning the logistics of just like, what do I have to replace in my pack to have myself set to be out there and have the water and have the electrolytes and have the fuel that I'm going to need for the next section of the course also be thinking,  how do I call myself down to the degree where I actually feel like I can, like,  Actually take the moment to say, all right, I finished that section.

That's the mission accomplished. Now let's just kind of move on to the next step and almost create like another of, or more events within the event to focus on and minimize the target timeframe that you need to cognitively wrap your head around at any given time. I think that's a big value add.

And it's one thing that is, it's not something that stands out the way like, Oh, I need to have X amount of calories or X ounces of. fluid or my electrolytes or something like that, where people are more intuitively understanding that those things are necessary to have before they leave. So  that was one of the big things I noticed.

The other thing I just like was thinking about in general along those lines is like aid station time or non moving time in general. So  is a pretty wide variety of what you see with an event like this. You'll see people that have a more skewed moving to non moving time, meaning like they spend more time not moving and their average pace from the second the race starts to the second they cross the finish line is skewed slower because they're just taking more time in aid stations.

And then there's going to be people that don't sleep at all for something like this.  but also end up maybe moving a little bit slower at times. So I talked to some of the people that I thought would be interesting have interesting takes on this because I think as you get further into the middle and the back of the pack, stopping and taking rest breaks and naps and things like that are just going to be more likely to occur because you're just out there longer.

Like if you're finishing in, let's say almost five days versus. at the very front of the pack. The top runners this year, we're finishing right around 60 hours. So you're going through more nights, you're losing more sleep. You're going to have more sleep fatigue than say the people who are up front finishing a little bit sooner.

So it also becomes something where, depending on your goal, finishing time or your outcome, the strategy is going to be a little different. So it becomes more of a, like, what is your duration and how do we structure things for that? So if your duration is. I'm going to win this race and break the course record versus I'm going to just barely make it through the cutoffs.

You're almost doing a different event at that point, when it comes down to strategizing the non moving time side of things. It's similar where you don't want to waste time. Wasted time is wasted time. So you do want to be efficient. But I think the, the, the opportunity to accidentally not take enough time to make sure you take care of yourself is just a heavier variable than say it would be in a race like let's say Western States where If you make a mistake in an aid station at Western States, it's not good, but you're probably going to be in another aid station inside of the next five miles.

So you can remedy it much sooner. Whereas at Coca Dona, if you make a mistake at a major aid station, you might not be able to fix that mistake or remedy it for hours, in some cases, multiples of hours. So you can have, I mean, you can have like an eight hour stretch in some cases. So It's just one of those things where I think you have to be a little more cognizant of what the actual opportunity cost is.

of making a mistake here and then having to try to remedy it without having the resources that you would at a typical ultramarathon. And what really that means to me is just when you're planning out your pacing strategy, being just a little more generous. With how much time you plan to spend at these non, or these, these major aid stations, just to make sure that you don't cost yourself hours by trying to save minutes because of something like tactical that could have been managed better due to the specifics of that type of an event.

The other interesting one that kind of fits within this was I was talking a little bit with Jeff Browning, who finished second this year after the race. And we were just chatting about, like, when is the right time to start considering taking a nap? And you know, Jeff's thinking from the perspective of competing for the win.

So it's going to be that kind of framework. And I think the pressure with that group of people is to try to sleep as little as possible, because if you lay down and take a nap, you have this situation where You kind of also have other guys who are in close proximity, other runners in close proximity to you who maybe aren't going to.

And then, if you take a 30 minute nap and they keep moving, you know, they may add 2, 3 miles to a lead or close that gap or pass you in that time frame. And there's this kind of competitive just angst that you're going to have when a situation like that occurs.  So you do want to be mindful of one, are you actually going to be able to fall asleep and make it worth it?

Because if you think I'm going to plan a time to sleep here and then you lay down and you can't turn your brain off because you're constantly just thinking about that next runner who's behind you or that runner that came into the aid station with you, that's not taking a nap and you just lay there and don't sleep, then you did kind of just waste that time for the most part. 

Versus a scenario where you feel tired enough to fall asleep, you take a nap, and because you took that nap, you sort of reset your brain, and you wake up feeling a lot more ready to kind of tackle the next section of the course. And then maybe your moving time improves to the degree that that 20 to 30 minute nap gets completely eclipsed and overtaken by the additional speed that you added to your pace for that next you know, hours, if not day if you go there.

So one thing Jeff mentioned is he's, he's leaning towards thinking that sleeping a little earlier probably pays off in the long run versus trying to kind of push further into the event and fight that off. And I think I agree with that. I think taking a nap early, if you can, if your body allows you to do it, should be something you're willing to do, even if it's something where you look around and other people kind of in that same pace category, you are not doing it yet.

I think sleeping early, if the sleep pressure is heavy enough, is going to be a value add at the end, versus avoiding that and then finding yourself You know, later on, just moving much slower because you're fighting an additional variable of like heavy sleep pressure that you could have potentially teased out.

The other interesting thing that Jeff mentioned was like, you kind of have these different types of sleep strategies. When I was out there crewing, I mean, I had a, I had some clients that they took up to a 90 minute nap, which that's a pretty good reset. I mean, you're getting a full sleep cycle in 90 minutes and if you get that, you're likely going to have a much longer stretch of time before you start feeling that sleep pressure catch up on you again,  versus a scenario where let's say you're out on the trail, you're between aid stations and you're just feeling the sleep pressure to the degree where you're like, I could just lay down and take a nap anywhere on the trail.

And this is one of the unique things I think you see at something like Coconut two 50 is if you're out there doing it, you might just come across a runner lying on the side of the trail, taking a nap in these kinds of trail side naps. They tend to be much shorter in duration. They can be as short as a minute.

Yeah. but kind of like usually in this like one to maybe 10-15 minute time frames. And what Jeff was saying about those is like you get these like little trail naps and they do help, but they're very fleeting in terms of how  long that impact lasts. So contrasting that with something that's a little longer, like a 30, 60, 90 minute nap at a main major aid station versus a five minute trail nap, you're just going to only get  You're going to get a shorter term kind of rebound from that.

So there is, there seems to be some degree of payoff beyond just Oh, I took a nap. I didn't take a nap that fits into the duration of it. Even with all the adrenaline and everything kind of goes into this stuff. So. I found that really interesting too along those same lines just sleeping in general I think one strategy that I went into this event with my clients and I came away thinking okay that this is Probably the way to do it is I don't think you can get too strict about when you're gonna sleep though I don't think you can say like, all right when I get to aid station At mile, let's just say 92.

They've got a good setup for sleeping there, or maybe your crew's there with a camper van or something. I'm going to take a nap there. If you get in there with such a rigid scenario, there's a good chance. You're just not going to actually be able to fall asleep and kind of have what I said before, where you just lay there and kind of waste your time. 

I think what you want to do is you want to have a scaffolding of like, where are some spots that I would likely. Want to sleep and some of those I think stand out a little bit if you have an aid station where you're coming through at a time when you're normally sleeping. So let's just say like 2 a.m. in the morning and it's like the second night There's a higher than average chance that you're going to be tired enough to sleep at that spot Especially if you haven't done much sleeping yet. So  doing that in a way where you kind of have in your list of things like If i'm tired enough to sleep here if the sleep pressure is such that I know I could just lay down and fall asleep Almost immediately That's a spot I'm going to do it and you can sort of like mark some of these optimal spots Just to have in the back of your mind or on your cruise list So that they're ready for that when you come in and then you are efficient with that and you're not wasting time trying to kind Of like figure out okay.

I didn't plan on sleeping here, but I'm super tired So i'm going on and then you and your crew waste the next 10-15 minutes getting something set up where you can actually fall asleep versus You coming in thinking there's a good chance they're going to sleep here. We have everything set up. If they come and say, Hey, I'm really tired.

We can have you laid down, covered up napping in a matter of minutes, and then save a bunch of time on over the course of the race, if you kind of have those structures set up and then just also like kind of a, what I was alluding to before being comfortable with potentially taking a trail nap or something, if you need to along the way, if that sleep pressure comes in.

The other thing I found interesting about that too, is just like the timing of caffeine. So. If you have that general idea of like, okay, I have this really good opportunity to sleep at this specific aid station, and you want to make sure that you increase the odds that you are going to actually be tired enough to fall asleep at that aid station and take advantage of that situation,  To me, that just means being mindful of kind of when you're taking caffeine hits in doses during the race.

You might want to be paying attention to that. So like, let's say you have a scenario where you're planning on, let's say again, arriving at that major aid station at 2 a. m., and you're roughly three hours out. It's 11 p. m., and you're thinking to yourself, I feel like maybe I could take some caffeine.

Actually, let's say you have two gels. You have a caffeine gel and a non caffeinated gel. If you can tolerate it, I would say go with a non caffeine gel there, so that when you do get to the aid station, you're less likely to be, or you're less likely to have that, that optimal sleeping opportunity get taken from you because of just the mistiming of the caffeine that could have otherwise been done a little bit differently.

So thinking about stuff like that I think is, is just kind of the way you want to go with it. The other one thing that I was really thinking about during the course of this event was  with the, with, if I go back to kind of what I was talking about before, where that first stretch for the coca dona to 50,  There's like this long stretch where you go through the heat, very little support.

They had like a water drop in there, which I guess this year someone stole a bunch of the water. So they had the, the runners had like a rationing of how much water they could pick up at this water drop. And the rations, I believe I remember I got cut in half because of the water theft. So it's like, it's just one of those things where it's like, if you planned the bare minimum going into that.

And now you find out you get a half ration refill. You could find yourself in a lot of trouble. And then ultimately like. playing catch up for a large portion of the next, you know, stretch of the race, or having to kind of take a longer than needed or expected break at the next aid station because of it.

These are the sort of things you kind of have to consider when you're getting into this. There's like, so there's a lot of uncertainties that you can't necessarily plan or account for. So when you're like, Deciding how aggressive to get keeping in mind things like that do happen or can happen and you want to make sure you balance those risks with what is it going to be like to say like, well, they're asking for us to take four leaders, but technically I could carry six show.

Should I carry six or should I carry the minimum four? And you know, I think when you're in those early stages like that, Taking a little more than what the minimum is, is in most cases, probably a good idea, but it kind of leads me into the next thing, which is this, the thought process I've been having that I think is really interesting about the sport where,  you know, we consider ourselves endurance athletes for obvious reasons with these ultra marathons and these 200 milers, but really there's so many more variables outside of just like. 

Your capability as an endurance athlete will impact how you're able to perform on a course like this or an event like this, that I think actually potentially identifies different groups of people that maybe otherwise wouldn't necessarily shine in a typical endurance event. And one of those things is like processing limits and fluid loss rates, and even to some degree, like electrolyte loss.

So, the way I was thinking about this was like, if you're somebody who. let's say you lose a lot of fluid per hour from just sweat  and you have a scenario like at coca dona and sedona where you have this long stretches of distance and time and heat where you only have access to so many fluids  you may have an issue with processing limits where if you're losing well above and beyond what your body's actually built a process even if you can't carry that fluid  It may not be something that you can tolerate by just sort of forcing it down.

There's like a potential limit or not a potential. There's a limiter. And everyone's going to be a little different with this. There's going to be like population averages, but then there's going to be people on either side of that kind of average in terms of how much fluid they can actually take in and process.

At any given time and get away with it and have it actually work out in their favor. So.  I just wonder sometimes with these events like this, like if we get enough competitive pressure with them over the years, will we just start selecting for people who have these like really efficient fluid loss rates and have these like higher than average processing limits.

So not only are they losing less fluid, but they're also able to process higher amounts of fluid and just things like that. You can keep going on and on with this one too cause there's also just like electrolyte loss. So I've done a lot of,  a lot of content on electrolyte loss and things like that with different guests and solo topic based episodes in the past.

But like, if you remember from some of those, I mean, you can have people that are as low as two to 300 milligrams per liter of sweat. And then you have people as high as over two grams. So you're looking at like a 10 X essentially from like those polar ends. Granted, most people are going to fall somewhere in the middle, but Again, with enough competitive pressure, do we find a scenario where there's like this kind of sweet spot where maybe you lose a minimal amount of electrolytes per liter of fluid and therefore are just more efficient with one more logistic that could potentially go wrong?

It gets to be like a situation where I think if you struggle with heat and hydration and things like that,  you can try to, you can almost overcorrect. And I think we may have seen this. I don't think he's been public about it. Mike McKnight had a really interesting situation where he retained a ton of fluid.

I think he weighed nearly 20 pounds more after the race than he did before, which you think about as like, you know, traveling 250 miles partially through extreme heat and managing to actually retain more fluid than you lost it, something's going wrong there, right? You're, you're, you're overshooting your fluid, your fruit, fluid processing, or you have an electrolyte imbalance that's creating an increase in fluid retention that wouldn't otherwise be there.

And I mean, I, for Mike, it's like, it's not like he was just, Being totally haphazard about it. As far as I can tell, I think it was just a product of he's been doing this race now for years, and he's had a lot of issues with dehydration. So for him, he's probably more fearful of not getting in enough fluids.

And the more likely mistake for him to make at that point is not to again,  find himself without enough, but force himself to have more than he probably can process and end up in a situation like he did this year. A lot of moving parts with that one though, too, between just like sodium and potassium balance and things like that.

So you know, there's, there's, there's a lot to unpack with that. And I think that's just something where with a sport like this and the relatively limited amount of research we have and the research we do have being extrapolated. you know, into multiple days versus shorter duration. Things are where I think a lot of the guesswork ends up happening with people like that.

So, I mean, you can do some basic things like  you can test your sweat loss rates and find out like, well, how much liter of sweat do I lose per hour of running when I'm in like, Cooler temperatures, moderate temperatures and hot temperatures and start kind of putting to grab to some ballpark figures and then looking at data in terms of processing limits and things like that and just deciding like, you know, maybe it's a bad idea to try to force three liters of water into the system at one given time because, or in an hour time, because it's just not going to process that much.

So it's not doing yourself a favor to do that, even if you feel like you're going to lose that much. So  to some degree, I think this all kind of goes back to, as I was talking about before, where.  If you need to be more conservative with, like, pace and effort early on because you know yourself to be somebody who has a harder time with processing limits or fluid intake, fluid loss, and that sort of thing. 

It just might be something where like when you look at like a race like this length Everyone is going to have strengths and everyone is going to have weaknesses So the closer you can get to identifying where your strengths and weaknesses are and where they can be taken advantage of on the course It just kind of draws a personal blueprint for you in terms of what spots you want to make sure you're not taking risks You're not burning matches and then which areas you can potentially do that because my general mindset with this stuff is like If you're operating on a spot that is your relative weakness, that's just not the spot you should be taking risks.

And if you, but if you're in a spot where like this is a relative strength of mine, if there's a time to take a risk or a time to be a little more aggressive, that's going to be the spot because your, our error margin is just going to be larger through there. This entire like  stuff I've been talking about so far just kind of highlights one of the topics I want to talk about, with coca dona and Sedona, which are just uncertainties.

It's just one of those things where I think an ultra marathon in general, especially as you get into the longer ones There's this sort of like I there's this sort of a mindset I like to teach that is like there's going to be something that happens That you don't have a perfect plan for that. We didn't sit down and say okay when this happens, this is what you do. So you need to be kind of aware that the likelihood of that happening is almost certain when you get into a race as long as 250 miles.

And some of it's going to be controllable and some of it's going to be uncontrollable, meaning some of it's going to be something where when you find out that you made a mistake or that something bad happened, you could think to yourself, Okay, I messed up. I should have done that differently. Had I done that differently, I would be in a better spot right now, or it could be something totally out of your control.

So some examples would be like that water theft, like nobody going into the race at Coca Dona probably sat down and in their plan said, okay, this is what we do if someone comes and steals half the water at that first water drop.  So that's an unpredictable, Uncertainty, but you still have to deal with it.

So the mindset then is like, okay. I've just been dealt this new set of cards. What's the best play here based on what I have available to me versus trying to kind of force what you were going to before with the prior expectations. So sort of like being able to recalibrate expectations based on circumstances that are outside of your control.

The other one would be things, but you just found yourself in a situation where you made a mistake. So maybe it was like, okay, I only brought four liters of fluid with me for that first section. I took the minimum. I really needed five and you get to a point where you realize you needed five. It's too late to go back and remedy that.

So it's really easy to let your mind kind of beat yourself up in that situation. And then anytime you're kind of struggling, just think like, Oh man, if I could just, if I could have gone back and done that differently, I screwed up. If you keep beating yourself up like that, that's just such a cognitive burden that you're laying on yourself. 

And like the people that I find are able to better manage those situations are the ones that accept, okay, I made a mistake here.  Pretty much everyone else is going to make a mistake at some point too.  Mine's happening now. So, So since I can't go back and do anything about it, just like the uncertainties, I need to refocus and decide what's the best path forward from here to the point where I can kind of course correct and I need to focus on that versus what is behind me and that I think kind of spins the mind into spending your mental energy on like the positive aspects or the things that you can actually do versus Burning that mental energy on things that you can't go back and do.

If you want to beat yourself up over it, wait till after the race, beat yourself up over it and, and use that as an opportunity to learn, use that as an opportunity to say like, okay, that's what that was a tactile mistake on my part, if I do a race like this again, I'm going to make sure I don't have that issue happen, or now I have more information that I didn't have before.

So put that on the list of things to account for next time I do this, so we can refine the process and do a better job next time. But you need to be able to kind of separate that process. That time to address that topic in that situation  as to when you do that and when not to do it and when to not do it is during the race when to do it is after the race when you're looking at what the learning opportunities are.

Another thing that I think is just an interesting overall topic with this type of event is running versus hiking. So I think a lot of times even with an ultra marathon, we call it ultra marathon running a lot of times and it's just like  I always kind of wonder about that. It's like, to what degree is it ultra marathon running versus, or maybe a better way to look at this, where's the crossover point and at what finishing point for certain durations, is it just as much or more hiking  as it is running?

And what do we do with that? So when you get to events like the Cocodona two 50, regardless of whether you're winning the race or whether you're finishing right before the cutoff the last finisher, you're going to be doing. a bunch of hiking. It's just going to be something that's required to make it sustainable moving through that sort of terrain in those sorts of conditions for that duration with the amount of sleep deprivation and everything that goes into this.

So  it's one of those things too, that when you're sort of planning out how do I structure My peaking phase for this particular event If you have a lot of time to spend on the trails or you're that type of person who just really likes long outings on the trails  I suspect most people probably are doing more running than they need to or should be doing in less time hiking and practicing that skill set  to the degree where like  Not only are you sort of skewing your skills In an imbalanced way for what you're actually going to do on race day but you're also putting yourself in a position where You're kind of setting an expectation in front of yourself through repetition as to what you should be doing when you're out there Which I think leads to people going out a little too fast So for example, if I looked at someone's race from beginning to end and we noticed that like let's say through the first You third of the race, they were doing like a 70 percent 30 percent run to hike.

Then the next 30%, they were doing a 50 50 hike to run. And then the last third, they were doing a 30 percent run 70 percent hike. So we saw this like gradual shifting from majority run to 50 50 split to majority hike. That would be a sign to me that  you're doing too much running and not enough hiking early on or essentially going out too fast.

And I think being a little more balanced in the early stages with being just a little more liberal with the hiking, even if it's an area where at that given time and in that kind of environment normally you'd be able to run if it weren't for the fact that you had another, let's say 210 miles to go, you'd easily be able to do it.

You have to be able to separate yourself from that Reality that yes, you can run right now, but no, it's probably not going to be in your best interest. And then when you have a scenario like Cocodone and Sedona, where the further you get into the race, the better the weather gets for running and the better the weather gets from avoiding things like overheating and dehydration, or having a situation where your fluid loss exceeds your fluid processing rates,  you want to reserve some of that ability to run for those sections versus trying to force it in a section where you're already sort of overheating  the system to some degree with the fluid processing and fluid loss side of things and just the relative extra fatigue you're going to get trying to push harder through hotter temperatures and things like that.

So. That's kind of my ongoing plug, I think, for ultra runners in general is assessing kind of your strategy between running and hiking and how to, like, really break that down so that you can kind of assess What is, what is a better strategy? And the reality is you're not going to be perfect with this.

So none of these things are like, everyone is off. We need to find more perfect approaches. I think this is a, this is a game of margins where it's like, okay, if we unpack. Let's say a hundred mile race that you did in the past and we see that deep depreciation of pace or skewing from run Skewing the ratios of run to hike over the course and now you're going to do something like coca dona 250  Chances are your if your approach for the hundred was too aggressive and you do a similar strategy.

It's going to be more amplified When you get out there longer like that So it just is something where you want to be that much more conservative Than you would have been otherwise. So at the end of the day, I mean Getting out there in coaching. I think my takeaways were some things that I think I would refine as a coach would be getting a little more specific about exactly what  You want to kind of have prepared and how much time you may need in some of the major aid stations to really kind of Hit that reset point in your mind and body to feel like when you go back out you're kind of okay I'm ready to take on the next phase versus this is just a continuation of whatever suffering I experienced in that last stretch and  Being maybe just a little less It's like a little less let's see if we can like kind of shave a minute here, a minute there when you're in those particular spots of the course.

The other one would be just like forcing, forcing just like a strategy that would maybe work better from a hydration standpoint. In shorter ultra marathons, meaning like, okay, there's a good chance. We can actually account for the majority of your fluid loss for this particular section by just being a little more aggressive with your hydration. 

There's just spots on this course where that just may not be the case. And I think you just have to slow things down in that case and accept that that's going to be something that you need to, you need to just move a little slower than maybe you would like giving an optimal scenario in order to feel better later on in the race and ultimately finish sooner.

The final thing would just be the real relative predictability. I think I went in with a good understanding that there's gonna be a lot of unpredictable things here, but  I would say, if anything, it was probably a little less predictable than what I would have assumed after seeing it from start to finish.

So, yeah. I go in there with a little bit more of a healthy mindset of making sure you're really, really clear about those unpredictable things and how that's going to be part of this process and being very comfortable with that part of the approach is going to be important. And I think from a preparation standpoint, what that means.

And one thing I did see when I was spending a lot of time in some of the aid stations is there was a pretty heavy range between like how. different runners had their crews structured. So oftentimes these runners would have one or more crews there, crew members there that would be helping them kind of get themselves set to go back out.

So  I think as a runner, your goal for some of these things is to be very detailed with your crews as to what you want them to do. So, They're not leaning on you as much because when you get in that aid station, if you feel like you're just on task in terms of telling people what to do, if you're like making orders and you're just kind of like responding to a bunch of questions and you're just like spending a lot of cognitive energy trying to, you know, Help your crew help you.

I see that as something that's going to make it less likely for you to feel like you actually had a reset to the degree. When you go back out, you feel reset versus narrow where you come in. And there's probably going to be things that you need to let your crew know about that. happened out there in that last stretch that you want to remedy.

Like maybe you had a blister on your toe that you weren't predicting and you have to tell your crew, okay, I got a blister on my big toe. We're going to have to pop them a shoe and sock off and address that. But there's going to be a lot of things that I think that you just know going in that you're going to need and you're going to want, and if you have your crew.

With a spreadsheet or with some sort of a setup where they know like, okay, this is my job. I have like these three things that I have to do and I have to be ready for it and I'm not going to bother the runner about it. I'm just going to execute. And unless I'm told by that runner to like alter that plan, that's the plan so that you don't have, if you have multiple crew members, them sort of like trying to figure out on the fly who does this and who does what, or trying to figure out what you need, it's mostly detailed.

So.  I think that kind of really helps with eliminating some of the, the predictable mistakes that can be made or the predictable problems that you can avoid by just doing a little more planning. All right, so that was kind of my coaching for the coca dona breakdown. It was a lot of fun to be out there.

It was something where  I think it's such a unique, Interesting aspect to ultra marathon running and I'm excited that it has gotten to a point where now these tuner milers are also very like well covered and respected. Parts of the sports. And I'm excited to see more people doing them. And as more competition enters these, see these finishing times get refined even further and better strategies put together and things like that.

And ultimately hopefully doing myself just so I can get the actual experience of, from what it's like to be the runner out there.